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wolven7If you plan your evening first thing in the morning, WOLVEN, the day will likely go smoothly. That's because you'll be so focused on the evening's entertainment that you won't let life's little delays and distractions bother you in the meantime. In general, the people around you are happy and positive. Projects progress so smoothly that you call it a day earlier than usual. What a welcome change!
Nine Inch Nails - [Hurt]--- Horror Scopes, full of encouragement, for the first time in a while. Things have... in fact, been working towards the better, tonight. Trying to get a handle on it. Which is good. Best way to do that? Talk about something of the theoretical propositions, on my mind. Let's get started.
I've been thinking, of course, of Blake. His Marriage of "Heaven and Hell," in which he proposes that the forces of Good and Evil, as they are known, in the world, are not only reversed, but should be seen as intrinsically linked to one another. (Yeah Yeah Yeahs - [Maps]). He suggests the ideal of Dynamic tensions, Opposites creating the universe, and the human condition, through their constant opposition. He thought, though, that "whoever tries to reconcile them seeks to destroy existence." That there cannot be existence, without warring, and opposition, but that this can be done with an Understanding, that the two are interwoven. (David Bowie - [Space Oddity]). This brings up interesting ideas, on it's own, as Blake wrote in the late 18th century, when these ideas were even more radical, than they'd be seen today. Which leads me to wonder, Did Blake Win, or Lose?
You see, today, there is much in the way of equivocation. The presence of the grey areas, in many people's thinking. That, perhaps, that which is seen as Evil is, actually, a working toward the Good. (Buffy the Vampire Slayer - [Intro Theme]). Because of this, many people, in the Black and White version of reality see things as disintegrating into Hell. (Buffy - [Spike Making Fun Of Angel]). There's much more of the consideration of the views of others, these days, and the thoughts that what maybe evil, may be the best thing, in the long run. And that, honestly, makes me smile, deep down, inside.
Moxy Früvous - [Horseshoes]--- I like the idea of people having, in their cores, or, as a patina, a light Haze on their conscience and soul-- as seen from the traditionalist Good V Evil standpoint of course *grin*-- the tiny essence of consideration. Wondering if maybe, just maybe, there is something to the point of view of their opposite team. If there might not be some isomorphism to their situations, and an understanding to be had. This doesn't negate the need to contend, but, understanding where someone's coming from doesn't mean you agree with them. (Gary Numan - [Dark]). You can still have Tension, and creativity, between the two, or however many, which brings, at its Centre, Epiphenomenally and Recursively/Paradoxically, Understanding, naming, and Creating the facets which brought it into being. Kind of like the mind, and the brain, if you modify Hofstadter's view, a bit.
Finished "Gödel, Escher, Bach: an Eternal Golden Braid," except for 14 pages of the index. (VNV Nation - [Darkangel (Apocalyptic Mix by Das Ich)]). There are... still things that i don't fully understand, and even more things with which i don't fully agree, but Hofstadter brings it all together, nicely, completely, and his logic holds itself, so i can't fault him, within himself. If he wants it that way, he can have it. But i digress; what i'm talking about, here, is his conception of Minds and Brains. He talks, for a very long time, and in many many ways, about the ideas of what brings about a mind, and the emotions, as software properties, from the hardware of the brain, and he mainly has to call it a KIND of epiphenomenon. (Jack Off Jill - [Bruises]). Which is a class of thing about which you may or may not know anything, so here.
Epiphenomena are phenomena that arise from sets of complex systems, seemingly of their own accord. They are not well understood. Specifically, the view that Mental events are cause by Physical brain activity, but the class can be generalized, to universal events. (Veruca Salt - [Seether]). In standard epiphenomenalism, everything is brain-based. There is nothing really "extra," and all effects stem from physical causes. The mental effects, produced, however, have No bearing on the physical processes of the brain. Which is silly. Because mental states can cause you to do things to yourself, and create things that change your neural patterns, but that's neither here, nor there. (Oingo Boingo - [Nothing Bad Ever Happens]). The point is that, in Hofstadter's view, things affect each other, and that the levels of inter-relation, in Symbols of the Brain ("Tree," "Blue," "Iguanodon," &c.), cause distinct effects in the way people are. (Res - [They Say Vision]). Thinking about "Self" and "Meaning" and things of these lines have actual meaningful effect in the nature of things in the physical world; how we act toward one another, how we try criminals, and questions of Free Will.
In Hofstadter's view, these things arise, from Brain States, and are unique and individual. They are made of the hardware processes, acting in an extremely complex manner, processing Thoughts, and Actions, thusly creating a level of How we react to thoughts and actions, in the world. Minds and Personalities are a Side-effect, in Hofstadter's world, of brain activity, though they are still utterly essential.
Powerman 5000 - [Get On Get Off]--- So-- to bring this back to my thoughts, and mullings-- the mind, the airy thing, of which there is nothing but ones and zeros (more concretely ephemeral, for those who don't like to think of the physical as the mental), acts on the mental, of which there are... Bolded ones and zeros. *nods*. (Sorry, needed to be done.). And they are closer together, and they create and interact with each other. (Darkest of the Hillside Thickets - [Shoggoths Away]). The brain creating the mind, epiphenomenally; hardware workings producing software functions, Max's Euclid spitting out 216 digits, &c. Then the Mind, in understanding itself (which is a place where Mr Hofstadter and I disagree), understands what makes it work, what makes it go, and, in that understanding, knows how to affect itself, and change it. Evolve it. (Tori & Maynard - [Muhammad My Friend (Live)]). Now we're in Akira territory.
We create and evolve the physical self, and the world around us, by coming to more complete understandings of the mind and Brain, and the physical and mental/spiritual/whatever workings, of the Universe. (Akira - [Tetsuo]). (Winamp, you're sick.) The Hardware and the Software interact, at that point, working together, while still in opposition, being able to connect to the one through the other, at any time accessing the creation point style singularity, at the Centre.
Now we're talkin' the good ol' beautiful individual Union with the Ultimate, and my Brain hurts. So i'm going to have to work this out some more.
Just don't start calling yourself "Lain of the Wired," and telling people "Wolven Said So."
Anyway, we still have to link Zen, but that should be pretty obvious, as, in this, all religious systems can be seen as different "Operating Systems," with which to get at the same essential Stuffs. Too perennial for you? Fine, then we'll look at it This way: The same stuff sprang the various operating systems, and is still there, somewhere, as a unifying, edifying tenet, but they all lead wherever you want them to take you, as long as you know how to hack it. I wouldn't suggest trying to crack it. You'll probably hurt yourself.
In the end, all systems have a quit prompt, anyway. Better fun to ride it all out, doing what you can, until then. But hey, all of this is only suggestion. Try cracking it, if you want; hell you may even be "supposed" (think about that word, as it is, right there. What does it mean?) to do that. *Grins.*
We'll See, won't we?
Later
{2.04am Jack Off Jill, Morphic Field - [Poor Impulse Control (750 Degrees Mix)] "Covetous Creature Remix"---
Sweet Dreams
You want people to see what is really going on. You
see what you see, and try to explain it, but it
seems everyone else is averting their eyes to
the truth.
What Tori Amos Song are you?
brought to you by Quizilla
Really weird, and annoying question format... But Deffinatetly an interesting payoff. Fitting.}
Nine Inch Nails - [Hurt]--- Horror Scopes, full of encouragement, for the first time in a while. Things have... in fact, been working towards the better, tonight. Trying to get a handle on it. Which is good. Best way to do that? Talk about something of the theoretical propositions, on my mind. Let's get started.
I've been thinking, of course, of Blake. His Marriage of "Heaven and Hell," in which he proposes that the forces of Good and Evil, as they are known, in the world, are not only reversed, but should be seen as intrinsically linked to one another. (Yeah Yeah Yeahs - [Maps]). He suggests the ideal of Dynamic tensions, Opposites creating the universe, and the human condition, through their constant opposition. He thought, though, that "whoever tries to reconcile them seeks to destroy existence." That there cannot be existence, without warring, and opposition, but that this can be done with an Understanding, that the two are interwoven. (David Bowie - [Space Oddity]). This brings up interesting ideas, on it's own, as Blake wrote in the late 18th century, when these ideas were even more radical, than they'd be seen today. Which leads me to wonder, Did Blake Win, or Lose?
You see, today, there is much in the way of equivocation. The presence of the grey areas, in many people's thinking. That, perhaps, that which is seen as Evil is, actually, a working toward the Good. (Buffy the Vampire Slayer - [Intro Theme]). Because of this, many people, in the Black and White version of reality see things as disintegrating into Hell. (Buffy - [Spike Making Fun Of Angel]). There's much more of the consideration of the views of others, these days, and the thoughts that what maybe evil, may be the best thing, in the long run. And that, honestly, makes me smile, deep down, inside.
Moxy Früvous - [Horseshoes]--- I like the idea of people having, in their cores, or, as a patina, a light Haze on their conscience and soul-- as seen from the traditionalist Good V Evil standpoint of course *grin*-- the tiny essence of consideration. Wondering if maybe, just maybe, there is something to the point of view of their opposite team. If there might not be some isomorphism to their situations, and an understanding to be had. This doesn't negate the need to contend, but, understanding where someone's coming from doesn't mean you agree with them. (Gary Numan - [Dark]). You can still have Tension, and creativity, between the two, or however many, which brings, at its Centre, Epiphenomenally and Recursively/Paradoxically, Understanding, naming, and Creating the facets which brought it into being. Kind of like the mind, and the brain, if you modify Hofstadter's view, a bit.
Finished "Gödel, Escher, Bach: an Eternal Golden Braid," except for 14 pages of the index. (VNV Nation - [Darkangel (Apocalyptic Mix by Das Ich)]). There are... still things that i don't fully understand, and even more things with which i don't fully agree, but Hofstadter brings it all together, nicely, completely, and his logic holds itself, so i can't fault him, within himself. If he wants it that way, he can have it. But i digress; what i'm talking about, here, is his conception of Minds and Brains. He talks, for a very long time, and in many many ways, about the ideas of what brings about a mind, and the emotions, as software properties, from the hardware of the brain, and he mainly has to call it a KIND of epiphenomenon. (Jack Off Jill - [Bruises]). Which is a class of thing about which you may or may not know anything, so here.
Epiphenomena are phenomena that arise from sets of complex systems, seemingly of their own accord. They are not well understood. Specifically, the view that Mental events are cause by Physical brain activity, but the class can be generalized, to universal events. (Veruca Salt - [Seether]). In standard epiphenomenalism, everything is brain-based. There is nothing really "extra," and all effects stem from physical causes. The mental effects, produced, however, have No bearing on the physical processes of the brain. Which is silly. Because mental states can cause you to do things to yourself, and create things that change your neural patterns, but that's neither here, nor there. (Oingo Boingo - [Nothing Bad Ever Happens]). The point is that, in Hofstadter's view, things affect each other, and that the levels of inter-relation, in Symbols of the Brain ("Tree," "Blue," "Iguanodon," &c.), cause distinct effects in the way people are. (Res - [They Say Vision]). Thinking about "Self" and "Meaning" and things of these lines have actual meaningful effect in the nature of things in the physical world; how we act toward one another, how we try criminals, and questions of Free Will.
In Hofstadter's view, these things arise, from Brain States, and are unique and individual. They are made of the hardware processes, acting in an extremely complex manner, processing Thoughts, and Actions, thusly creating a level of How we react to thoughts and actions, in the world. Minds and Personalities are a Side-effect, in Hofstadter's world, of brain activity, though they are still utterly essential.
Powerman 5000 - [Get On Get Off]--- So-- to bring this back to my thoughts, and mullings-- the mind, the airy thing, of which there is nothing but ones and zeros (more concretely ephemeral, for those who don't like to think of the physical as the mental), acts on the mental, of which there are... Bolded ones and zeros. *nods*. (Sorry, needed to be done.). And they are closer together, and they create and interact with each other. (Darkest of the Hillside Thickets - [Shoggoths Away]). The brain creating the mind, epiphenomenally; hardware workings producing software functions, Max's Euclid spitting out 216 digits, &c. Then the Mind, in understanding itself (which is a place where Mr Hofstadter and I disagree), understands what makes it work, what makes it go, and, in that understanding, knows how to affect itself, and change it. Evolve it. (Tori & Maynard - [Muhammad My Friend (Live)]). Now we're in Akira territory.
We create and evolve the physical self, and the world around us, by coming to more complete understandings of the mind and Brain, and the physical and mental/spiritual/whatever workings, of the Universe. (Akira - [Tetsuo]). (Winamp, you're sick.) The Hardware and the Software interact, at that point, working together, while still in opposition, being able to connect to the one through the other, at any time accessing the creation point style singularity, at the Centre.
Now we're talkin' the good ol' beautiful individual Union with the Ultimate, and my Brain hurts. So i'm going to have to work this out some more.
Just don't start calling yourself "Lain of the Wired," and telling people "Wolven Said So."
Anyway, we still have to link Zen, but that should be pretty obvious, as, in this, all religious systems can be seen as different "Operating Systems," with which to get at the same essential Stuffs. Too perennial for you? Fine, then we'll look at it This way: The same stuff sprang the various operating systems, and is still there, somewhere, as a unifying, edifying tenet, but they all lead wherever you want them to take you, as long as you know how to hack it. I wouldn't suggest trying to crack it. You'll probably hurt yourself.
In the end, all systems have a quit prompt, anyway. Better fun to ride it all out, doing what you can, until then. But hey, all of this is only suggestion. Try cracking it, if you want; hell you may even be "supposed" (think about that word, as it is, right there. What does it mean?) to do that. *Grins.*
We'll See, won't we?
Later
{2.04am Jack Off Jill, Morphic Field - [Poor Impulse Control (750 Degrees Mix)] "Covetous Creature Remix"---
Sweet Dreams
You want people to see what is really going on. You
see what you see, and try to explain it, but it
seems everyone else is averting their eyes to
the truth.
What Tori Amos Song are you?
brought to you by Quizilla
Really weird, and annoying question format... But Deffinatetly an interesting payoff. Fitting.}
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no subject
Date: 2004-03-19 10:30 pm (UTC)As for how you tied it in with Hofstadter...Bootstrapping the mind into another level is, I think, what many of Us are here for. That spark of birth-from-nothing, on a small scale...
Meh. I'm kinda babbling, now.
no subject
And yeah, that's why there IS the Yin-Yang opposition. It IS Creation.
re: addendum
Date: 2004-03-19 11:12 pm (UTC)Re: addendum
no subject
Date: 2004-03-20 05:28 am (UTC)no subject
Why do I have to keep saying this around you?
Date: 2004-03-20 10:33 am (UTC)One day a student asked Moore: "Does Marvin Minsky know what he is talking about? Is the mind really a society of independent agents?". "Why did you ask?". "Because if that is true, then there is no me". "Is there a Minsky?". The student was confused, and told Minsky about it; Minsky smiled and said: "No".
A master once asked Moore: "What is between the one and the zero". "Line noise".
Re: Why do I have to keep saying this around you?
Backwards S-shaped Line Noise, as i said once before.
Did I tell you...
Date: 2004-03-21 05:27 am (UTC)I think you would have found it...amusing, to say the least.
There is no apocalypse...just the server shutting down for maintanence. :3
Re: Did I tell you...
Dear Lord, i watched too much Lain...